[DUG] Auckland Event Details

Mon May 5 14:59:41 NZST 2014

Haven't followed RemObjects for a while, I know they showed great promise
some years ago and -perhaps still do, but I would personally look very
closely at www.xamarin.com for developing iOS and Android applications if I
had succh a requirement and did not want to use the native tools for those
respective platforms. Xamarin is now being "helped/supported" by MS to
ensure their tools are good, which also helps and you can build those
directly inside Visual Studio (if you are so inclined of course)

Regards

*From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [mailto:
delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz] *On Behalf Of *Jolyon Smith
*Sent:* Monday, 5 May 2014 2:41 p.m.
*To:* russell at belding.co.nz; NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List
*Subject:* Re: [DUG] Auckland Event Details

@David:

Your prescription that the approach must support single source is
arbitrary.  Heck, not even Embarcadero achieved this goal completely
satisfactorily, so by that criteria FireMonkey itself is a failure.

RemObjects approach is the more robust one.

Rather than trying to pretend that platform differences can be abstracted
away or reduced to lowest common denominator (as if the various user
communities of the various platforms were not themselves making their
choices precisely because of those differences, in many cases), those
differences should be embraced and the developers empowered to take full
advantage of them in order to provide the best solutions possible for
*each*platform, not limited to providing a solution that can be
deployed on
*all* platforms.

What should Embarcadero have done ?

Simple.  Instead of tossing Prism into the long grass, they should have
brought Elements into the fold.  Kept Delphi + VCL as their Win32 solution
with Elements as their .NET and mobile platforms offering.

But, frankly, as an Elements user who has previously experienced
Borland/Inprise/Codegear/Embarcadero's product management, development,
marketing and pricing at first hand, I am actually *very* relieved that
they didn't (and suspect that RemObjects themselves might have resisted any
attempt to do so).  ;)

The very fact that an outfit such as RemObjects have both the technical
nouse and capacity to deliver something like Elements whilst Embarcadero,
with far more resources at their disposal, are left buying up other
people's technologies and trying to create a marketing message around them
whilst rushing out poor quality releases (XE6 Hotfix 1 was out before the
ink had dried on the XE6 release EULA!) to keep the money mill churning,
should tell you everything you need to know about Delphi's future.

If RemObjects can do it, and if Embarcadero are everything that their
supporters crack them up to be, then Embarcadero should have been able to
deliver their own "Elements", especially given that they would have been
able to focus exclusively on a Pascal solution, if they so chose, without
the added distraction of a C# front end.

@Leigh....

Yes, Oxygene/Hydrogene (hereafter: Elements) when targetting Java, produces
Java byte code.  Just like the vast majority of Android code out there
(with the exception of games - the one type of app that the NativeActivity
support in Android was only ever intended for).  Oh, and the FireMonkey
apps.

One thing this means is that unlike FireMonkey, your target platform is not
confined only to Android and the Java environment provided there.  For
example, if you really wanted to, you could use Elements to create an
Eclipse plug-in.

Elements can produce Java code, hence Elements supports all Java based
platforms using all of the capabilities that those Java platforms supports
because - to all intents and purposes - when compiling for Java, Elements
*is* Java.  Just with a different language front-end.

As such, yes, it runs at Java speed, just like all the other Java code on
those Java based devices, Android or otherwise.  But it does so without
having to drag in a bloated runtime and a custom UI rendering engine (and
that's incorporated into EVERY FireMonkey app, btw).  Your apps take full
advantage of the device capabilities.

That includes, for example, ART, which is the Android technology that
allows Java based Android apps to be installed as pre-compiled, native code
binaries.  Just like FireMonkey apps, but without the embedded bloatware,
and with the ability to run on any Android device (that support ART, or
indeed of course all the ones that don''t).

But equally, when compiling for Cocoa, Elements is an LLVM compiler.  All
of the same advantages apply - you have complete, platform native access to
the platform with all of the benefits that accrue.  Whether that is Cocoa
(OS X) or CocoaTouch (iOS).

Similarly, Elements for .NET... any .NET based platform is available to
you, be that Windows.NET, Windows RT or Windows Phone.

How is the .NET support in FireMonkey these days, by the way ?   ;)

On 5 May 2014 12:59, russell <russell at belding.co.nz> wrote:

Always interesting to read strong opinions … even when presented as facts
and focusing on a few topics.

The analysis looks plausible. I cannot assess it well as I write for a
niche community  and RAD Studio serves me fairly well.

Russell

*From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [mailto:
delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz] *On Behalf Of *Jolyon Smith
*Sent:* Monday, 5 May 2014 11:13 a.m.

*To:* NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List
*Subject:* Re: [DUG] Auckland Event Details

What makes less sense is the way that they added support for those
platforms.  You are right to highlight the manner in which they have
managed to tick boxes.  Unfortunately it is *purely* an exercise in ticking
boxes.  Far less useful as a solid basis for continuing to be able to
*keep*those boxes ticked.

Delphi was always a niche product.  Despite the marketing, their
cross-platform solution is *not* Delphi for "iOS/OS X/Android" (and it
painfully clearly is not Delphi for .NET, let alone WinRT or WinPhone).  It
is "Delphi for FireMonkey", with the ability to deploy to any platform that
FireMonkey manages to cajole a semblance of support for within the
constraints of what the approach allows.

i.e. you cannot build true Android solutions using FireMonkey because the
way that FireMonkey works rules out certain capabilities of that platform.
 Similarly your FireMonkey Android apps will not benefit from ART.  Sure,
your FireMonkey app is "native code", but is also bogged down by the
non-platform native frameworks required to make even "Hello World"possible,
so whilst true platform native apps gain all the benefits that that
platform delivers, FireMonkey remains stuck in it's own world.

i.e. FireMonkey created a niche within a niche.

Having attracted the interest of Delphi developers to the platforms that
FireMonkey ticks the boxes for, many of those developers will quickly
realise the limits and look instead at the alternatives, at which point
they realise just how far behind Delphi has fallen over the years while
Embarcadero wasted their time on the Smoking Chimp.

As for the renewed interest in developing the VCL, this can be seen as a
return to core value, or it could be seen as a belated recognition that
FireMonkey is not in fact the secure future for Delphi/Embarcadero that it
was supposed to be, and worst of all, without any viable strategy for
supporting the platform on which that core value rests - i.e. the latest
and future versions of Windows - even that core value is now at risk.

For myself, I now use a combination of RemObjects Elements and Xcode for
most of my work.  Delphi is now very much a legacy platform.

On 5 May 2014 10:46, David Brennan <dugdavid at dbsolutions.co.nz> wrote:

It was a good seminar IMO. I understand why Embarcadero have decided to
spend so much time adding support for OS-X, iOS and Android, at some point
we may even take advantage of it. More importantly though I’m glad they
seem to have realised that now they have ticked those boxes they need to
return to address quality across the product.

I just hope that XE7 will continue that trend so that the Delphi IDE and
executables continue to improve in speed and robustness. I’m also hoping
that XE7 will see a big push to make Code Insight bulletproof (or as bullet
proof as such a thing can be, given that if you screw your syntax up
completely midway through a big change it is always going to struggle, but
it would be nice if it returned to fully operational once you tidy things
up a bit!).

Cheers,

David.

*From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [mailto:
delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz] *On Behalf Of *Jeremy Coulter
*Sent:* Monday, 5 May 2014 10:10 a.m.
*To:* NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List
*Subject:* Re: [DUG] Auckland Event Details

Yeah let us know hen its done. We didnt attend the presentation for various
reasons, although it would have be good, so am looking forward to hearing
what Marco had to say.

Jeremy

On Mon, May 5, 2014 at 9:51 AM, Alister Christie <alister at salespartner.co.nz>
wrote:

I managed to spend a number of hours with Marco after the presentation, and
have about an hour and a quarter recorded, which I will make available
after Marco has reviewed it.  It was great talking with him, it seems that
Embarcadero made a good choice appointing him Product Manager for Rad
Studio.

Alister

 Alister Christie

Computers for People

Ph: 04 471 1849 Fax: 04 471 1266

http://www.salespartner.co.nz

Follow us on Twitter http://twitter.com/salespartner

PO Box 13085

Johnsonville

Wellington

On Wed, Apr 30, 2014 at 8:43 AM, Gary Benner <gary at benner.co.nz> wrote:

HI All,

Sorry this is a little late but just got back from a trip overseas.

To endorse Alister's comment, great opportunity to meet Marco.

cheers

Gary

Please see below details for the RAD XE6 Launch. Please will you forward
this email invitation to members of the NZDUD to register/attend the event.

Date and Venue:

Friday, 02 May: Auckland

Venue: Rydges Auckland - 59 Federal Street Cnr Kingston Street, Auckland
1010, New Zealand

Time: 8.30am Registrations, 9:00am – 12:00pm

http://forms.embarcadero.com/AP14Q2NZDeveloperDirectLIVE

The event will be hosted by Damien Bootsma with special guest-speaker,
Marco Cantu, RAD Studio Product Manager, global luminary & author of over a
dozen books on Delphi. This event is not to be missed, so register NOW, as
spaces are limited!

Be amongst the first to see live previews of RAD Studio XE6 and all of the
great new technology, with the latest enhancements to the VCL and more.
Here's a glimpse of what is in store:

Empowering your VCL codebase and developer productivity

• Give Your VCL apps a new look-and-feel with improved VCL Styling
• Introducing Win 7/8 taskbar buttons

Database, integration and scalable services with RAD Studio XE6

• Core Database Features Improvements
• New FireDAC Database Explorer and more
• Working with JSON and XML
• Building scalable and secure DataSnap services

Embrace and Extend Your Mobile and VCL applications

• App Tethering
• Not reinventing the wheel with new BAAS Client components

"Turning on" to mobile and The FM Application Platform

• Introducing Android support in C++Builder XE6
• App Monetization with Advertising and In-App Purchases

Evolution within a revolution: Summary and Q&A

If you are an application developer, technologist or development team
leader and interested in modernising your VCL apps & extending your
applications to mobile devices for your customers, then this event is for
you!

Kind regards,

Mike

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