[DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington

Thu Jul 3 12:45:24 NZST 2014

I'd say that if you already have sufficient doubt to trust them to honestly
represent their own work then it doesn't really matter what the code looks
like, whoever's code it may be.  ;)

On 3 July 2014 12:35, Jeremy North <jeremy.north at gmail.com> wrote:

> Also how do you know they actually wrote it.
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 3, 2014 at 10:09 AM, Jolyon Smith <jsmith at deltics.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
>> One possible problem with asking to look at old code is that this would
>> often break confidentiality requirements with a previous employer/client.
>>
>> I also have to admit that when I read some (*SOME*!) of my old code it
>> gives me the shivers.  People can get better over time y'know.  :)
>>
>> I think perhaps a better approach might be to ask someone what they
>> *think* of the code they wrote in the past.
>>
>>
>> On 3 July 2014 12:03, Leigh Wanstead <leigh.wanstead at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> To know if he/she is a good developer is very easy. Just read the code
>>> he/she wrote in the past.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 3 July 2014 11:51, Jolyon Smith <jsmith at deltics.co.nz> wrote:
>>>
>>>> As you say John, the measure of "good" is a complex issue and may even
>>>> vary from project to project according to the needs of those projects.
>>>>  Technical proficiency (in any specific area) , mentoring skills or
>>>> knowledge (OO or again, in whatever area) can all be gained as and when
>>>> needed but may or may not be relevant to a particular project.
>>>>
>>>> Ultimately it comes down to a combination of knowledge and approach,
>>>> and the "fit" in these areas that a developer has with the needs of any
>>>> particular project.
>>>>
>>>> In my experience, the best developers are the curious and caring ones.
>>>>  By which I don't mean the ones that people raise an eyebrow to/at and who
>>>> get all teary eyed at a soppy movie, but who - when faced with a problem or
>>>> a challenge - seek first to fully understand it before rolling up their
>>>> sleeves and cutting code.  And when they do produce code, they care about
>>>> the clarity and structure of it.  "Working code" isn't good enough for such
>>>> people, it must also have some aesthetic other quality.
>>>>
>>>> i.m.e more often than not, ugly code turns eventually out to be wrong
>>>> code.  I know when I'm on the right track to a solution because it not only
>>>> works, but it makes a sort of obvious sense and has a certain elegance that
>>>> cannot be simply designed in.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> But, as I say, it's a highly complex area and I don't think there is a
>>>> simple check list of qualities that categorically identify a "good
>>>> developer".
>>>>
>>>> Which is perhaps why it is also difficult to determine the value of
>>>> one, resulting in the tendency to place value on more easily measured
>>>> qualities, such as scarcity, experience (as measured in years), etc etc
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 3 July 2014 11:20, John Bird <johnkbird at paradise.net.nz> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>   OK that begs a further discussion!
>>>>>
>>>>> What in your eyes makes a developer “good” as opposed to thinking they
>>>>> are good – specific qualities please of what the good qualities are.  I am
>>>>> wondering if there are many opinions of what a “good” programmer is which
>>>>> might explain why some think they are good whilst others think they are
>>>>> not.  What are the more objective measures?
>>>>>
>>>>> I have worked on numerous projects the last few years and seen a lot
>>>>> of different talents.  Some that stick out in my experience are:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>    - Technical proficiency – ie knowing already what is likely to be
>>>>>    the best technology to use to tackle a new problem
>>>>>    - OO depth.   Is it innate or learned?   How is it best learned?
>>>>>    - Ability to mentor and guide others through existing code
>>>>>
>>>>> Curious to hear specifics from you as you have the reputation of a
>>>>> Delphi authority!
>>>>>
>>>>>  *From:* Jeremy North <jeremy.north at gmail.com>
>>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, July 3, 2014 10:23 AM
>>>>> *To:* NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List
>>>>> <delphi at listserver.123.net.nz>
>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington
>>>>>
>>>>>  I know here (Australia) we would happily pay decent salaries if we
>>>>> found Delphi developers that were actually good and didn't just *think*
>>>>> they were good.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Jul 3, 2014 at 8:06 AM, Stefan Mueller <
>>>>> muellers at orcl-toolbox.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>  As a Swiss Delphi Developer living in New Zealand I find that
>>>>>> interesting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Switzerland isn’t exactly at the top of my mind when I think about
>>>>>> the “value for bucks” for outsourcing work to – not because you don’t get
>>>>>> the quality, but because salaries there are almost twice what you would
>>>>>> have to pay here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  Kind regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  *Stefan Müller*,
>>>>>> R&D Manager
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *ORCL* *Toolbox Ltd.*
>>>>>> Auckland, New Zealand
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> P Please consider the environment before printing this email
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This message is intended for the adresse named above and may contain
>>>>>> privileged or confidential information.
>>>>>> If you are not the intended recipient of this message you must not
>>>>>> use, copy, distribute or disclose it to anyone.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [mailto:
>>>>>> delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz] *On Behalf Of *Tony Blomfield
>>>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, 3 July 2014 9:29 a.m.
>>>>>> *To:* 'NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List'
>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gary.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you would like to send the details to me I will have a chat with
>>>>>> them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unfortunately we have had such a bad run with Kiwi Developers we
>>>>>> moved our R&D over to Switzerland last year where we get much more cost
>>>>>> effective results.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyway, I’d like to assess the person myself to see if they are
>>>>>> suitable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kind regards.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Tony Blomfield
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [
>>>>>> mailto:delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz
>>>>>> <delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz>] *On Behalf Of *Gary T. Benner
>>>>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 2 July 2014 2:32 p.m.
>>>>>> *To:* delphi at delphi.org.nz
>>>>>> *Subject:* [DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> HI All,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This just passed in if anyone can help:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Permanent Developer available in Wellington.*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Experienced Senior Delphi Developer looking for a permanent role in
>>>>>> or around Wellington. *
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Open to remote work. Also open to learning a new language if needed.
>>>>>> Experienced in picking up code from others and looking after legacy systems
>>>>>> as well as new development.*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Also experienced as a Development Manager and Product Management.*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyone with an opportunity can email me at gary at benner.co.nz and
>>>>>> I'll pass it on.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> cheers
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gary
>>>>>>
>>>>>> List Admin
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gary Benner MNZCS ITCP
>>>>>> Information Technology Certified Professional
>>>>>> Onlearn Limited <http://www.onlearn.co.nz> - Online Learning Hosting
>>>>>> & Support, Training & Content Development
>>>>>> 123 Internet Limited <http://www.123.net.nz> - Managed Web Hosting,
>>>>>> Virtualisation, High Availability Systems & Cluster Technologies
>>>>>> Semantic Limited <http://www.semantic.co.nz> - Software Development
>>>>>> & Systems Design, Online Education, e-Commerce
>>>>>> Disaster Warning Systems Limited <http://www.diwa.co.nz> - Public
>>>>>> Emergency Warning and Communication Systems
>>>>>> *Mob:* 021 966 992
>>>>>> *DDI:* +64 7 543 1206 <%2B64%207%20543%201206>
>>>>>> *Email:* gary at benner.co.nz
>>>>>> *Skype:* garybenner
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ref#: 41006
>>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>
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