<div dir="ltr">yeah, thats another approach. Might work.</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Jolyon Direnko-Smith <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jsmith@deltics.co.nz" target="_blank">jsmith@deltics.co.nz</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">A more reasonable approach might be to introduce a way of pricing support separate to the license itself. Any new price structure would apply to all customers but mean that customers that place excessive demands on support then have to at least pay more (for the support, not the license).<br><br>Then they might come to the realisation that the product isn't for them ("costs us more than it's worth to us") but even if they don't at least their demands for support should pay for itself.<div><br></div></div><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 16 January 2017 at 12:12, Jeremy Coulter <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jscoulter@gmail.com" target="_blank">jscoulter@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Thanks guys. Yes Jolyon has raised some good points. Yes the customer IS difficult and I just dont think my product is for them.<div>I had thought of increasing the Annual Lic fee, but saying this because of all the extra support they need and I need to cover cost, but also encouraging them to look for another product.......or something like that so that it becomes THEIR decision etc.</div><div><br></div><div>I could just shut down the company and create a new one...hehehehe....</div><span class="m_2925418010191351318HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><div><br></div><div>Jeremy</div></font></span></div><div class="m_2925418010191351318HOEnZb"><div class="m_2925418010191351318h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 10:11 AM, Jolyon Direnko-Smith <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jsmith@deltics.co.nz" target="_blank">jsmith@deltics.co.nz</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">aiui anything that specifically penalises that one customer is potentially discriminatory, not <u>just</u> outright refusal to serve.</div><div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788HOEnZb"><div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 16 January 2017 at 09:50, Robert Martin <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:rob@chreos.co.nz" target="_blank">rob@chreos.co.nz</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204moz-cite-prefix">Hi<br>
<br>
I suspect all the Jolyon says is true. However nothing stops you
increasing the price of the license to cover additional support
costs for the user in question. I am guessing they are a
difficult customer, you could encourage them to make the decision
themselves :)<br>
<br>
Cheers<br>
Rob<div><div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
On 16/01/2017 9:44 AM, Jolyon Direnko-Smith wrote:<br>
</div></div></div>
<blockquote type="cite"><div><div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439h5">
<div dir="ltr">IANAL but I would say that unless your terms of
sale include an explicit reservation to refuse to provide a
license in exchange for the advertised price then you would need
to be able to provide a substantive and legitimate reason to
refuse. The fact that you have already sold them a license and
now wish to effectively rescind and reverse that decision makes
it even harder I would suggest, unless you can establish a
violation of the license terms to support that decision.<br>
<br>
Bear in mind that "Management reserves the right to refuse" has
to be taken together with obligations under the human rights act
(including prohibiting discrimination on basis of ethics and/or
politics as well as more obvious reasons or race, gender,
religion or sexuality etc). So you would need
non-discriminatory reasons to, uh, discriminate.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Retail stores have a slightly stronger case in that they
are also private property and as such are able to exercise a
right to refuse entry to the store as a matter of trespass
(though human rights observations still apply), but I am
guessing this does not apply in the case of a license sale
which presumably does not necessitate or involve the customer
physically entering any premises in order to complete the
purchase of a license.<br>
<br>
But again, IANAL and would should probably take proper legal
advice on the matter.</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 15 January 2017 at 20:22, Gary T.
Benner <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:gary@benner.co.nz" target="_blank">gary@benner.co.nz</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div> <span style="color:#ff0000"><b><span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif">[Reply]</span></b></span>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#000000">HI Jeremy,</span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#000000">The issue will come down to
the exact terms under which you sold the licence.
Not just the payment terms.</span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#000000">Be careful because if the
customer is reliant on the software for their
business, and not "transgressed" the terms of the
licence in any way, you should be prepared to
justify your actions in Court, should they decide it
is worth the cost to them.</span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#000000">Usually you really need to
give a years notice of ceasing support, allowing
them time to move to another product.</span></span>
</p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#000000">Happy 2017</span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#000000">Gary</span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#000000">A</span><span style="color:#ff0000"><b>t 19:57 on 15/01/2017 you
wrote </b></span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>To : <a href="mailto:delphi@listserver.123.net.nz" target="_blank">delphi@listserver.123.net.nz</a></span></span>
</p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>CC : </span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>From: Jeremy Coulter, <a href="mailto:jscoulter@gmail.com" target="_blank">jscoulter@gmail.com</a></span></span>
</p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>Content Type: text/html</span></span>
</p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>Attached: </span></span>
</p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>Hi All. Sorry
i know this is off topic but I cant remember the
offtopic</span></span> </div>
</div>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>email address.</span></span>
</p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>I provide my
software on an annual license fee.</span></span> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>I have a
customer who I would prefer NOT to provide a new
license too when</span></span> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>their license
expires, giving them ample notice of course... for
various</span></span> </div>
</div>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>reasons.</span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>I would
assume there are no real issues from a legal point
of view? I am</span></span> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>the one
issuing the license (as software owner) and I
would therefore be</span></span> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>able to issue
to whom I wish too, or not in this case.</span></span>
</div>
</div>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>I just wanted
to know if there is something I havent thought of
and I dont</span></span> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="m_2925418010191351318m_3806564250296241788m_-7214682997365655439m_4561592522808787204h5"> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>and up make a
tit of myself :-)</span></span> </div>
</div>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">>Thanks, Jeremy</span></span>
</p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
<p> <span style="font-family:MS Sans Serif"><span style="color:#008000">></span></span> </p>
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