[DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington

Fri Jul 4 09:17:52 NZST 2014

Hi John,

Thanks for the suggestion. I cannot change the domain name.

Regards
Leigh

On 3 July 2014 19:32, John C <jc at sunshinesoftware.co.nz> wrote:

> To get rid of this hacker, would it perhaps be an idea to change domain
> name?
>
>
>
> Cheers
>
> John Ch
>
>
>
> *From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [mailto:
> delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz] *On Behalf Of *Leigh Wanstead
> *Sent:* Thursday, 3 July 2014 7:22 p.m.
>
> *To:* NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List
> *Subject:* Re: [DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington
>
>
>
> Hi Robo,
>
>
>
> Thanks for the suggestion.
>
>
>
> The issue is once add captcha, the hacker will just simply treat this as a
> signal and use another cookie and another ip.
>
>
>
> Regarding to render the website in Javascript, how are you going to stop
> the browser driven by script? The hacker does not need to understand the
> javascript. All he need is just grab dom element.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Leigh
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 19:09, Robo <robo555 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> As a user (and web developer) I would hate to see a website using png as
> text, not being able to copy and paste and unable to accomodate different
> screen resolutions (especially in age of tablets and phones) is a severe
> usability problem.
>
> One of the method used by Amazon is to detect usage pattern, then
> implementing a delay for every 10 page views, add captcha, etc.
>
> The better alternative to using PNG would be to render the website in
> JavaScript. So it looks normal when rendered on browsers, but the content
> or even the whole DOM is built from obfuscated JS. Don't build this
> yourself, plenty of existing code on the web.
>
> Robo
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 3, 2014 at 4:49 AM, Leigh Wanstead <leigh.wanstead at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Jolyon,
>
>
>
> Thanks for the answer. That was exactly I am doing for the last two years.
> I managed to auto detect such bot.
>
>
>
> To solve this issue completely, I suggested to my boss to use image
> instead of text to display html content. This way the hacker must use ocr
> to extract the text from image. For normal website user, there is not much
> downside to read a png file compare to read html text. I guess that I
> manage to protect that valuable information :-)
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Leigh
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 14:39, Jolyon Smith <jsmith at deltics.co.nz> wrote:
>
> If you can identify this person/bot then you should be able to incorporate
> some analytics into your website to identify them also.  i.e. if there is
> some obvious pattern to the requests (particular sequence of pages
> requested) or some frequency with which requests are made from the same IP,
> which identifies requests from that IP as unusual.
>
> Since you seem able to recognise this miscreant yourself, the first step
> would be to incorporate this analysis and to log when you believe your
> analysis has identified the bot.
>
>
>
> Once you are satisfied that your analysis is identifying only the
> bot/rogue user and not throwing up false positives you could then add code
> to add IP's identified by the analytics to your block list or however you
> choose to deal with it.
>
>
> You should also look into what capabilities, if any, your web server
> platform provides in this area (since this is hardly a new or unique
> problem - others will already have solved this problem in ways that may be
> applicable to you).
>
> IIS for example has a Dynamic IP Restrictions Extension which potentially
> addresses at least some of these issues.
>
>
> http://www.iis.net/learn/manage/configuring-security/using-dynamic-ip-restrictions
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 14:22, Leigh Wanstead <leigh.wanstead at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Cameron,
>
>
>
> Thanks for the reply.
>
>
>
> It is not google bot. The website is a public website, so I cannot
> whitelist any ip.
>
>
>
> Actually the basic question is how to stop robot to grab the website? I
> believe the guy want to steal information or want to crash the website
> (deny of service).
>
>
>
> The trouble for me his log request ruin my web log and take up server cpu
> resource. I sometimes ended up 99% request from him and it was on going day
> and night.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Leigh
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 14:05, Cameron Hart <Cameron.Hart at flowsoftware.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
> sounds like google bot is indexing you J
>
>
>
> you will need to determine his pattern so you can monitor and block it
> dynamically.
>
>
>
> sounds like it’s not a public site as you wont tell the address so you
> could whitelist your users IP’s and block everything else.
>
>
>
>
>
> *Cameron Hart *
>
> *Flow Software Limited *
>
>  [image: Flow]
>
> PO Box 302 768, North Harbour
>
> *P *
>
> +64 9 476 3569
>
> Auckland 0751, New Zealand
>
> *M *
>
> +64 21 222 3569
>
> www.flowsoftware.co.nz
>
> *E *
>
> cameron.hart at flowsoftware.co.nz
>
>
>
> This message is intended for the addressee named above. It may contain
> privileged or confidential information. If you are not the intended
> recipient of this message you must not use, copy, distribute or disclose it
> to anyone.
>
>   P Please consider the environment before printing this email
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [mailto:
> delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz] *On Behalf Of *Leigh Wanstead
> *Sent:* Thursday, 3 July 2014 2:02 p.m.
>
>
> *To:* NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List
> *Subject:* Re: [DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington
>
>
>
> I have a question for you guys related to how to be a good developer to
> solve the problem :-)
>
>
>
> I am developing a website and someone is using some sorts of script to
> drive a browser to grab all the data from the website. I cannot use login
> method. I cannot use recaptcha at the time they use the website. I am
> already using cookie to log behavior. That guy always clear the cookie
> after I detected him. He is always changing ip address if I block him from
> that ip address. He is using the ip all over the world i.e. Australia, NZ,
> usa, Russia.
>
>
>
> What to do?
>
>
>
> I guess the hacker is not in this email list, so it is ok to discuss it.
> And please do not ask me the website name I am developing.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Leigh
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 13:29, Steve Peacocke <steve at peacocke.net> wrote:
>
> I think there's another few sides to this as well and it all depends on
> "your" definition of a good developer.
>
>
>
> Having lead technical teams for a number of years, I know that you can
> have not only different skill levels, but different knowledge and
> specialised areas even within senior developers. In any team, developers
> have their own specialisations relating to the type of work that the
> company does. Work can often be given to them because they are the one
> member in the team who knows about this or that.
>
>
>
>  For example, I know very senior developers who have never created a
> component in their lives, or others who are well known and seen as some of
> the very best in the industry, but may never have done a complete
> application design. Others may never have created a DLL or linked to
> external hardware.
>
>
>
> I do have a real problem with this "ask specific questions" way to
> determine if they are a good developer. I know of some who would ask
> university-type questions to explain some specific UML design without
> realising that other companies don't actually use  UML's, or some others
> who are convinced you are not a good developer if you can't describe some
> OO phrase exactly by the book without realising that no-one actually speaks
> that language outside of university, despite the fact that they program
> that way by nature.
>
>
>
> I do remember being once asked to explain the difference between some
> obscure technical terms to do with encapsulation (I had never heard a
> programmer utter those words since coming out of university), but was able
> to then totally stump the interviewer when I asked back if they could
> explain the difference between parent and owner.
>
>
>
> A Senior Developer in any of the teams that I have lead or worked in could
> be more easily described by the amount of real world abilities to problem
> solving and delivery to the users expectations, and their interaction with
> the customer, yet a good programmer would be one that could program a
> specific given task - there is a difference.
>
>
>
> As for getting a coy of some old code - yes, that might be good but I tend
> to know programmers who hoard their precious code chunk, taking it with
> them everywhere and can produce it immediately. On the other hand, I have
> an old SQL builder program that I add to over the years and use to learn
> new ways of doing things with and learn how to get under the hood of the
> database and data structures - but I'd hate for others to see that code as
> it's forever a work in progress and used solely to learn (although the
> application is still in use around the world).
>
>
>
> Steve Peacocke
>
> +64 220 612-611
>
>
> On 3/07/2014, at 12:45 pm, Jolyon Smith <jsmith at deltics.co.nz> wrote:
>
> I'd say that if you already have sufficient doubt to trust them to
> honestly represent their own work then it doesn't really matter what the
> code looks like, whoever's code it may be.  ;)
>
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 12:35, Jeremy North <jeremy.north at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Also how do you know they actually wrote it.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 3, 2014 at 10:09 AM, Jolyon Smith <jsmith at deltics.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
> One possible problem with asking to look at old code is that this would
> often break confidentiality requirements with a previous employer/client.
>
> I also have to admit that when I read some (*SOME*!) of my old code it
> gives me the shivers.  People can get better over time y'know.  :)
>
> I think perhaps a better approach might be to ask someone what they
> *think* of the code they wrote in the past.
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 12:03, Leigh Wanstead <leigh.wanstead at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> To know if he/she is a good developer is very easy. Just read the code
> he/she wrote in the past.
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 11:51, Jolyon Smith <jsmith at deltics.co.nz> wrote:
>
> As you say John, the measure of "good" is a complex issue and may even
> vary from project to project according to the needs of those projects.
>  Technical proficiency (in any specific area) , mentoring skills or
> knowledge (OO or again, in whatever area) can all be gained as and when
> needed but may or may not be relevant to a particular project.
>
> Ultimately it comes down to a combination of knowledge and approach, and
> the "fit" in these areas that a developer has with the needs of any
> particular project.
>
> In my experience, the best developers are the curious and caring ones.  By
> which I don't mean the ones that people raise an eyebrow to/at and who get
> all teary eyed at a soppy movie, but who - when faced with a problem or a
> challenge - seek first to fully understand it before rolling up their
> sleeves and cutting code.  And when they do produce code, they care about
> the clarity and structure of it.  "Working code" isn't good enough for such
> people, it must also have some aesthetic other quality.
>
>
>
> i.m.e more often than not, ugly code turns eventually out to be wrong
> code.  I know when I'm on the right track to a solution because it not only
> works, but it makes a sort of obvious sense and has a certain elegance that
> cannot be simply designed in.
>
>
>
> But, as I say, it's a highly complex area and I don't think there is a
> simple check list of qualities that categorically identify a "good
> developer".
>
>
> Which is perhaps why it is also difficult to determine the value of one,
> resulting in the tendency to place value on more easily measured qualities,
> such as scarcity, experience (as measured in years), etc etc
>
>
>
> On 3 July 2014 11:20, John Bird <johnkbird at paradise.net.nz> wrote:
>
> OK that begs a further discussion!
>
>
>
> What in your eyes makes a developer “good” as opposed to thinking they are
> good – specific qualities please of what the good qualities are.  I am
> wondering if there are many opinions of what a “good” programmer is which
> might explain why some think they are good whilst others think they are
> not.  What are the more objective measures?
>
>
>
> I have worked on numerous projects the last few years and seen a lot of
> different talents.  Some that stick out in my experience are:
>
>
>
>    - Technical proficiency – ie knowing already what is likely to be the
>    best technology to use to tackle a new problem
>    - OO depth.   Is it innate or learned?   How is it best learned?
>    - Ability to mentor and guide others through existing code
>
> Curious to hear specifics from you as you have the reputation of a Delphi
> authority!
>
>
>
> *From:* Jeremy North <jeremy.north at gmail.com>
>
> *Sent:* Thursday, July 3, 2014 10:23 AM
>
> *To:* NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List
> <delphi at listserver.123.net.nz>
>
> *Subject:* Re: [DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington
>
>
>
> I know here (Australia) we would happily pay decent salaries if we found
> Delphi developers that were actually good and didn't just *think* they were
> good.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 3, 2014 at 8:06 AM, Stefan Mueller <muellers at orcl-toolbox.com>
> wrote:
>
> As a Swiss Delphi Developer living in New Zealand I find that interesting.
>
> Switzerland isn’t exactly at the top of my mind when I think about the
> “value for bucks” for outsourcing work to – not because you don’t get the
> quality, but because salaries there are almost twice what you would have to
> pay here.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
> *Stefan Müller*,
> R&D Manager
>
> *ORCL* *Toolbox Ltd.*
> Auckland, New Zealand
>
>
> P Please consider the environment before printing this email
>
> This message is intended for the adresse named above and may contain
> privileged or confidential information.
> If you are not the intended recipient of this message you must not use,
> copy, distribute or disclose it to anyone.
>
>
>
> *From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [mailto:
> delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz] *On Behalf Of *Tony Blomfield
> *Sent:* Thursday, 3 July 2014 9:29 a.m.
> *To:* 'NZ Borland Developers Group - Delphi List'
> *Subject:* Re: [DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington
>
>
>
> Gary.
>
>
>
> If you would like to send the details to me I will have a chat with them.
>
>
>
> Unfortunately we have had such a bad run with Kiwi Developers we moved our
> R&D over to Switzerland last year where we get much more cost effective
> results.
>
>
>
> Anyway, I’d like to assess the person myself to see if they are suitable.
>
>
>
> Kind regards.
>
>
>
> Tony Blomfield
>
>
>
> *From:* delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz [
> mailto:delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz
> <delphi-bounces at listserver.123.net.nz>] *On Behalf Of *Gary T. Benner
> *Sent:* Wednesday, 2 July 2014 2:32 p.m.
> *To:* delphi at delphi.org.nz
> *Subject:* [DUG] Work Wanted in Wellington
>
>
>
> HI All,
>
> This just passed in if anyone can help:
>
> *Permanent Developer available in Wellington.*
>
> *Experienced Senior Delphi Developer looking for a permanent role in or
> around Wellington. *
>
> *Open to remote work. Also open to learning a new language if needed.
> Experienced in picking up code from others and looking after legacy systems
> as well as new development.*
>
> *Also experienced as a Development Manager and Product Management.*
>
> Anyone with an opportunity can email me at gary at benner.co.nz and I'll
> pass it on.
>
> cheers
>
> Gary
>
> List Admin
>
>
> Gary Benner MNZCS ITCP
> Information Technology Certified Professional
> Onlearn Limited <http://www.onlearn.co.nz> - Online Learning Hosting &
> Support, Training & Content Development
> 123 Internet Limited <http://www.123.net.nz> - Managed Web Hosting,
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> *Email:* gary at benner.co.nz
> *Skype:* garybenner
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>
> Ref#: 41006
>
>
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